Page Or is a mere warning on the label all that is required in that specific state? I found the enthusiasm for industrial additives disappointing. Bromate for example "strengthens gluten and increases the fermentation tolerance of dough Bromate being a carcinogen is mentioned, but nowhere is it suggested that its presence is actually undesirable. The quote "several countries" in which it is banned actually include all 27 members of the EU, Canada, and seemingly most of the rest of the world.
Disappointingly all the formulae for specifically ice cream include milk powder and both "stabiliser" and "monostearate". And there's a great emphasis on pasteurisation - which is understandable in the catering environment. There's almost zero overlap with Lebovitz's "Perfect Scoop". They are from different universes. And then similarly there's the enthusiasm for industrial ingredients.
From page , just one example. As an amateur bread-baker, the most useful part of the book looks likely to be the pages of non -bread stuff. Similarly, for example, I rather suspect that enthusiastic amateur chocolatiers wouldn't learn very much from the chocolate section. However, within that bread section, there's stuff that I find frankly implausible. Just one example: Pages 68 to 72 are dedicated to "How to calculate mixing time". I simply do not believe the premise for this -- that the only factor to consider is the total number of mixer revolutions. Regardless of mixer design, etc.
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Rotation speed directly and very simply affects mixing time. Seemingly from the examples calculated, a planetary mixer will develop dough almost twice as quickly as a spiral mixer. Can that really be true? I'm also unhappy in relation to dough oxidation during mixing with the concept that it is a "natural property" of salt to "slow down chemical reactions which is why it is used to increase the shelf life of of foods like cured meats or salted fish ".
BUT salting fish or meat does not delay its oxidation - salting acts by inhibiting spoilage microrganisms, a different matter entirely. Hence its dubious that "By incorporating salt into the dough at the beginning of the mixing Strangely, there's no mention there about deliberate oxidation by intensive mixing being an essential part of the infamous Chorleywood Bread Process - and where salt addition is not delayed.
Disappointingly, I've found just two references to Glutathione in the text and none in the index. Glutathione is an enzyme that occurs naturally, notably in dead yeast, its effect being to make dough less 'strong' but more extensible. One reference in the book is regarding the use of 'deactivated yeast' as a deliberately added dough conditioner, the other in discussing the industrial freezing processes available to permit fresh bread to be offered all day, every day.
And that as "fresh" compressed yeast ages in storage, its glutathione content increases. IMHO, that sort of thing ought to be in an "Advanced" book. The treatment of bread staling is cursory at best. Pages to 4. Freezing or for once utterly unidentified "chemicals" are said to be the only options to delay staling. Curiously, I've found nothing whatsoever discussing different flour milling - or even mention of roller grinding, let alone proper rather than nominal stone grinding - and the different qualities of the flour that they offer the baker.
Combine this with the fondness for industrial additives and ingredients, plus the passing mention of sourdoughs and rye, and it is abundantly clear that this is not a treatise on artisan baking. Far from it. The books sub-title is "a professional approach". I'd suggest that "a catering approach" might be more apposite.
OK class, revision questions - name the two types of pesticide employed in the baking industry - that's right - general-use pesticides and restricted-use pesticides - page 42 - though if there is any more useful detail than that, I've not found it. But I found its content less impressive when examined in detail than the initial impression suggested. Specifically regarding baking bread for quality , I think there's much more of practical use in Hamelman's book.
The most useful bits for me are going to be the areas where I know little or nothing - cakes, icing, pastry, biscuits Simply, I felt that it was necessary to explain and give a few examples of those aspects of the book that disappointed me, and had not been touched on in previous posts. To go against the flow of almost unqualified praise, I think justification should be shown.
I hope I've managed that, in a reasoned and reasonable manner.
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I would rather save my breath but, yes, use of bromates in flour is illegal in California. This is just one example. I am sure that Michel and the others would appreciate your feedback and I think you should offer it to him. I did flip through the chocolate section and I did notice a glaring error on page , Figure the legend for the graph doesn't match up to the labels. That was just while skimming through the book to see what it offered. I believe that if you approach the book as a scientist which it seems you're doing , you'll be disappointed in this and many other books. You claim to be an amateur, yet you're discussing things that I think even most professional bakers those making their living in the industry would be hard pressed to either understand or care about.
As a text book like so many texts it is meant to cover a broad range of topics whether in depth or not. I don't interpret the tone to be "unrelentingly didactic", I think it is the perfect tone for a text. Again, I haven't read the entire book yet. I'll be sure to come back to this topic when I have taken a closer look at the text, but I think one will find that even as a professional, there is a lot to be learned from this book and others like it.
I have no relationship with SFBI or Michel Suas, but a text like this must have been a tremendous undertaking and I continue to believe that it is a large step above the current benchmark written by Wayne Gisslen. As an aside, I'm not sure what "catering" means in England My classmates and I baked most of the recipes in Advanced Bread and Pastries, and I can tell you they all work.
Which is more than I can say about any other cookbook I own.
Second, dougal, you seem like a valuable, intelligent person, but you need someone to tell you that that was a rant, not constructive to anyone or anything. I'm glad the recipes work. That's always a good thing and not always a certainty. I don't believe, however, that dougal's criticism was in any way a rant. He or she offered a fair, thorough critique of the book as an "advanced" text from the point of view of a an "advanced" amateur baker.
And I found the critique informative and valuable.
Will it it preclude me from buying the book? Certainly not. Will it make me give the book a more jaundiced peruse than I might have otherwise? And I thank him her for it. Too many books hit the shelves without a serious review. I am concerned about trans fats. I am concerned about bromates and whether they have a place in the non-industrial kitchen.
Whether or not recipes work is one thing. Whether or not those recipes contribute to a downward spiral of industrial shortcuts and dubious ingredients is entirely another. I, for one, want to know both. That is the only way a consumer can make an informed decision. I'm not condemning the book. It's in my Amazon shopping cart as we speak. But we can't condemn it its critics for pointing out its shortcomings, either. Especially if those shortcomings involve questionable ingredients and processes.
That's just good reviewing. An Edge in the Kitchen. I'll see what I can do; off the top of my head: salt preserves the carotenoid pigments, which are critical flavor compounds in wheat. I will reference pages regarding mixing and see what I can post regarding the quality of information presented. Honestly, I have just skimmed through the book and remain convinced that it is a "must have.
The price is totally in check for a book of this quality. This is why I consider it a "must have. To reduce the risk of sounding redundant or defensive, I will refrain from participating more in this discussion to the best of my ability. I agree that rotation speed is definitely a factor in mixing time, but in that section of the book the rotation speed was explicitly defined as a constant speed 1 , making the number of revolutions and the mixer model the only other major factors to consider.
I've read about this from a number of sources, most notably from King Arthur Flour and I think from Hamelman's book. Salt does delay oxidation -- perhaps it has something to do with its hygroscopic properties? Pasteurizing the dairy in ice cream enhances the flavor greatly -- the difference between scalded and unscalded ice creams is night and day. I really don't think it's a food safety issue when they tell you to cook the milk since it's safe for them to assume that the milk you're using has already been pasteurized. Also, several more accessible options for stabilizers and monostearate are mentioned in the book.
Recommended Posts. Posted January 26, Share this post Link to post Share on other sites. Louis, MO Review in St. Posted February 7, Posted February 12, I just wanted to make sure that there was both metric and lb measurements since I tend to lean on one or the other depending on what I'm measuring.
I also had my eye on the Friberg book, but Suas' book seems like the better deal if I had to pick one.
I do have some experience with breads and a smidgen with pastries but want to take it to the next level. I have both and is it very good reference, but you must study them. Some people they buy the books just colect them. I think those two books are best. Just received the book from Amazon. The book is simply amazing. The photography is excellent.
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The amount of detail in the subjects covered is a bit much right now, but I know it will eventually become useful as I get more experience. I am so glad that you really like the Advanced Bread and Pastry book. I have always been reluctant to recommend restaurants, movies or books because one person's delight may be another person's misfortune. I also finally got a copy of the book, and I have finished reading the bread part of it. It's a quite heavy tome, and it packs lots of useful information about the bread baking process.
Similar to Steve, I also found the parts about mixing very interesting to read.
Advanced Bread and Pastry by Michel Suas (Hardback, 2008)
In addition, it covers various pre-ferments very well, it has a great part about scoring bread, and the layout and illustrations are all helpful. There's also a decent section on sourdough. This part of the book is probably very similar to the content of a new book by Daniel DiMuzio Bread Baking , so those unwilling to splurge might want to hold out for that one instead. I was pretty disappointed about the bread recipe selection in Suas' book. There are lots of creative, nice looking breads, but most of them are very heavy on wheat flour, and precious few of them are based on wholewheat, rye, spelt or semolina.
Is this related to the American bread market? I'm curious, since the book seems aimed towards the budding bakery professional? Or perhaps it's due to the author's French origin? Personally, I think the recipe section could benefit greatly from more diversity, with more wholegrain, wholewheat and rye breads included, especially since there's also a growing interest in more healthy bread varieties. To conclude, I think the bread baking theory was neatly presented, with lots of useful information for pros and home bakers alike, but the recipe selection left a lot to be desired.
Hans, I tend to agree with your evaluation of the book. I find it more valuable for the theory and technique content than for the recipes. At least for the section on bread, I think the book was meant more as a "How to Skip to main content. Advanced Bread and Pastry. April 25, - am.
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Apr 25 - pm. Apr 26 - pm. Apr 30 - am. SteveB, Appreciate your posting. Howard - St. Augustine, FL. Jun 1 - pm. Jun 2 - am. Jun 4 - pm. Amazon did you well! Let us know what goodness comes out of it- by way of your oven! Audra, I was really surprised. Jun 5 - pm. The reviewer includes a couple of minor typos found. Maybe the reviewer is, as Julia Child used to say, a closet food terrorist :- Howard - St. It makes me want the book right now!